Interview: Author NANCY GARDEN

Interview by Natascha Scrivener

How did you feel about the Kansas City School ban of 'Annie on My Mind' in 1993? 

I had just gotten home from a writers' conference when I got a phone call from a man from PEN, which is a well-known writers' organization. "Do you know that your book has just been burned in Kansas City?" he asked. 
I didn't know, and I was stunned. At the conference, someone had asked me if I'd had much trouble with ANNIE, and I answered that I hadn't. I had anticipated trouble when ANNIE was first published, but for the most part it was was received enthusiastically, at least as far as I knew. I did get a hate letter from a woman who, quoting Scripture, said I should be "drowned in the depth of the sea," but that was about all! 
The man from PEN asked if I'd like to see a fax of the newspaper coverage of the burning, and of course I said I would. I don't have a fax machine, and my partner and I were at our place in Maine, so I had to drive to the library in the next town to get the fax. On the way, still stunned, and thinking, "Only Nazis burn books!" I pictured my book in flames, the nice cover of its new paperback edition curling with the heat, turning black, and probably smelling horrible. 
The fax told me that a fundamentalist minister had burned ANNIE ON MY MIND on the steps of the building housing the  Kansas City School Board. (Much later I saw a video of the TV news coverage of the burning and saw that he'd also burned the picture book HEATHER HAS TWO MOMMIES by Lesléa  Newman. ) 

What had prompted the burning?

Well, ANNIE and a book called ALL AMERICAN BOYS by Frank Mosca had, unbeknownst to me, been donated  by a gay organization to 42 schools in and around Kansas City, in both Kansas and Missouri. The organizarion was trying to ensure that accurate information about homosexuality was available in the schools. Some of the schools already had ANNIE on their shelves, but those that didn't either kept the book or removed it--and removing it amounted to a violation of the First Amendment to the US Constitution. 

How did I feel after I saw the fax?  Still stunned, but not really surprised. As a former gay activist, I'd often run into homophobic slurs and threats; they go with the territory.  But even so, it certainly was shocking and unsettling to think of an actual book burning here in the US! 
The rest is a long story with a happy ending.   In Olathe, Kansas,  a group of brave students and their parents sued to have ANNIE returned library shelves in their school district. And in 1995,  after a trial in federal district court, the Olathe district was ordered to put ANNIE back.  During the two years of struggle before that, my partner and I made three trips to Kansas and Missouri, and met many people on both sides of the issue.  Many of them were embarrassed and sad that a book had been threatened in their community. And although some people seemed to be reacting solely out of anti-gay prejudice, others seemed genuinely afraid that reading about homosexuality can actually harm children or make them become gay.  That belief, when it's geniune, can be helpful to keep in mind when one is fighting censorship attempts! 

How do you react to a bad review of one of your books? 

It depends on whether the criticism is fair or unfair. If the reviewer seems to think I should have written a different kind of book, which is sometimes the case, or if the reviewer's criticisms are otherwise unfair, then I'm angry!  But if the reviewer points out legitimate flaws, I'm both grateful and embarrassed.  Bad reviews are disappointing and hard to read, but they can be helpful and one can learn from them. 

Are the names of the characters in your novels important? 

Absolutely!  Often the right names pop into my head right away, and that's wonderful. But sometimes as I write, I realize a name is wrong, so I have to change it. And sometimes I can't think of the right name for a character. I've been known to look in "name the baby" books for first names, and in phone books for last names. 

What about the titles of your novels? 

Yes, they're very important, too. Since the title and the cover are the first things a prospective reader sees of a book--and the title is the first thing an editor sees when an author or an agent is trying to sell a manuscript to a publisher.  First impressions are vital, so both title and cover are enormously important. 
Titles often spring to my mind the way characters' names often do. But when they don't, finding the right one can take a long time. I don't remember what I wanted to call my first novel, but I do remember that the editor wanted a different title and she and I tried hard to come up with a good substitute. Finally, after an informal in-house contest in the publisher's office, we all agreed on WHAT HAPPENED IN MARSTON. 
 I wanted to call my second novel, whose main character is a boy, THE MONDAY NEST; a bird's nest seen on a Monday is mildly important in the story. But my editor pointed out that boys wouldn't be attracted to a novel with that title.  We ended up calling the book THE LONERS--a much better title, although it's close to one belonging to another book: THE LONER. 

Are there any occupational hazards to being a novelist? 

I guess the main ones are problems that stem from using a typewriter or a computer for hours on end. When I was using a typewriter--first a manual, then an electric, and finally an electronic (an electric typewriter with a computer-like  ability to make corrections and to store a small amount of copy and type it out automatically when needed)--when I was using those machines, I developed a pinched nerve in my neck which led to my having carpal tunnel-like symptoms in my hands and arms.  (I've never been a gentle typist and I suspect that my banging on the keys also contributed to those problems!)   Now I use a computer, but  like many writers, I feel some effects stemming from that or exacerbated by it--some eyestrain, and various aches and pains. 

I adored 'Annie on My Mind', 'Good Moon Rising,' and 'Nora and Liz' when I was a teenager (I still do in fact), which of your books do you feel the most attached to, or the most proud of? 

I really don't have a favorite, and I often answer that question by saying it's similar to asking a mother which of her children is her favorite; many moms say they love all their kids equally but differently. 
ANNIE is one of my favorites, though, as is GOOD MOON RISING.  But I'm especially fond of ENDGAME and HEAR US OUT as well, plus DOVE AND SWORD, and a book for younger kids called PRISONER OF VAMPIRES--all for different reasons--plus PEACE, O RIVER, which has been my partner's first choice and that of a bookstore owner friend, too. 

Did you have a favorite chapter (or part) to write and why? 

That's an interesting question, but again, I can't really answer it in terms of one book.  While I'm working on a novel there's often a scene that I enjoy rereading more than the others as I review the manuscript over and over again. But I rarely if ever remember or think of that scene after the book is published. If I reread a book after it's published (which I seldom do unless I have to talk about it in public),  I guess I probably remember particularly liking a specific scene--especially if it turns out to be one that I pick to read aloud! 

Do you work with an outline, or just write? 

How I work depends on the specific book. I do often develop a very informal outline as I'm writing, once I've drafted a chapter or two.  I usually have a pretty clear idea of the ending--of what problem will be resolved at the end, for example--but not necessarily the specifics of how that resolution is going to be reached.  Since I do know that much, once I've begun the book and gotten to know the characters a little, I'm often able to see what should happen in the next few chapters--so I make a list of those chapters and jot down the key things that happen in each one.  But, as I write more, I change the outline and also rearrange and/or add to it. 

Do you ever experience writers block, and if so, have you found a solution to it? 

Although I've certainly been stuck sometimes, I don't think I've  ever had real writer's block. If I'm stuck, taking a walk, doing housework, or running errands--doing anything physical--usually helps "unstick" me enough so I can go back to work. 
One thing I do try to do and that I advise students to do if they're worried about writer's block is always to stop the day's work when you know what is going to happen next in the story.  That usually ensures that you can plunge right in when you go back to work the next day. 
There are a couple of additional things I suggest to students.  One is brainstorming on paper: At the top of your page, write "I want to (or I have to) write about_________, but I can't think of how to begin. I just wrote__________, but that didn't work. Maybe I could say ________________--but that sounds really lame. Or maybe_______________..." 
Keep going with that, or with variations of it, and if you're lucky, you may well find something that works! 
If you're writing a novel, it sometimes can help to move on to a scene later than the one on which you're stuck. Or if you're at the very beginning and can't think of an opening scene but have an idea for a later one, start at a later point in the story. If you habitually get stuck at the end  of a book or story, try working out the end, at least in general, before you write the beginning. There's no rule that says you MUST begin at the beginning! 

What is your writing process like? 
It varies somewhat from book to book, for each book has its own demands. 
If I know before I start that there are things I'm going to have to research, I try to do at least some of that before I begin. 
After I've written a chapter or two, in addition to the outline (if I'm going to make one), I usually write "autobiographies" for my main character and other principal characters. I pretend to be each character writing about himself or herself from early childhood till the time the book opens. If I know what problems or issues the character is going to face, I try to lay the groundwork for how he or she will react to them.  For example, if someone important to the character is going to die, I try to have the character write about his/her felings for that person while the person is still alive.  If my character has already experienced the death of another person (or an animal), I have him or her write about that. I also try to have each character write about other important characters in the book and his/her feelings toward them, plus important events up to the time when the book opens, and his/her attitude toward things like family, school, religion, sports, hobbies; his/her likes and dislikes, fears and dreams. 
Some writers describe the main character's closet or room or house--that's a good idea, too--and it's also kind of fun!  (Be careful, though, of using that description in too much detail in the actual novel, unless it's important.) 
I write first drafts very quickly, and I write the whole book before revising except for small bits that I realize as I progress will need to be different. In that case, I sometimes I go back and change those things roughly, or I just make notes about the changes that I'll have to make more carefully later when I revise the whole book. 
Other writers perfect every page or every chapter before they go on to the next one.  I admire them for being able to do that, but I feel a need to see the whole book before I revise and polish. 
As I write the first draft, I try to keep track of when events/chapters take place, often writing a date or day of the week in the margin.  (These dates and days are not the date or day on which you wrote the material; it's the fictional date or day on which the characters lived that chapter or event.)  I find this technique is helpful later  on, especially if your book covers a longish period of time--or if it's a book, like a mystery, in which when things happen is vital. It can also be a help much later to the book's copyeditor, so I usually try to keep those time notes in the manuscript  as I revise.  (I usually also write a note on the final manuscript explaining what the dates are about and saying that they shouldn't appear in the published book.) 
When I've finshed the first draft, which is usually very rough, I usually go back right away and revise it, sometimes rewriting large sections, adding things, cutting things, honing sentences and paragraphs, trying to solve problems that emerge with timing, relationships, logic--in other words, fixing any flaws I see throughout. I also try to catch typos, errors in spelling and grammar, etc. I continue checking for those things every time I revise. 
And then, after that draft, or perhaps after a third one, unless I already have a specific deadline, I put the book away for weeks, months, even a year or more so that when I go back to it I can (I hope!) see its flaws more clearly. When I take it out again, I revise it some more and polish it--until I think it's just about as good as I can make it, and then I give it to my partner to read. I usually have more changes to make after she's read it and we've discussed it.  After I make those changes, I read the book over one more time, trying to read not as the author but as a reader.  If I can't think of any more to do with it,  I finally send the manuscript  to my agent or editor--and as soon as I can after that, while I'm waiting to hear reactions to it, I usually start work on something else. 
Again, this process varies depending on the book, but that's usually the general outline. 

Why do you write? 

I'm one of those people who has to write.  I'm happiest and feel most like myself when I'm working on a book. 

As the mother of a little girl, I will encourage her to read your books (when she is old enough to read!)  Do you feel it is important for ALL teenagers, whether they identify as gay, straight, or bisexual to read your books? 

I assume you mean my LGBTQ books.  I feel it's important for all kids to read as widely as they possibly can, and I'm of course very pleased when their reading includes some of my LGBTQ books--and those of other authors. 

Are you working on anything at the moment? 

Yes, I'm working on a novel I've been working on off and on for a number of years, and I'm mulling a new one over in my head. That's part of my writing process, too: once I get an idea for a book, I wait to see if it sticks with me, and if it does, I work on it in my head before I put anything down on paper. Then, as I continue to work on it in my head, I usually jot down notes about it until I'm ready to actually start writing. 

Do you get a lot of feedback from young readers? 

I do get quite a bit of feedback from young readers, yes--but not the tons of feedback some other authors get.  With some kids, that feedback leads to a correspondence, sometimes lasting for years. 
Writers tend to find they have a few words that they use a lot. What are your three favorite words? 
I wouldn't call them "favorites" really, except in jest, because I spend a lot of time searching for them and weeding them out!  I'm not sure what the third word is, although I'm sure there is one, but the two I seem to have used the most are "smile" and "grin" in all their forms--oh, and for a while "little," too.  At the time she mentioned that one,  my editor even said that several of her other authors had also been overusing it!  In the last couple of things I've written, though, I seem finally to have reduced the smiles and grins.  Someone who read an early version of the book I'm working on now said I'd used "lame" a lot (lame in the slang sense of  being ineffectual, not in describing difficulty walking). I had no idea of that until I looked for it and found that she was right--so perhaps that's my third "favorite" word now! 

Why do you write for children rather than for adults? 

Why do I write for kids?  The stories of kids' lives, their growth and development, their struggles and their often painful journey to maturity fascinate and move me. Also, kids are often very careful readers; they don't let writers get away with anything!  And kids also tend to be more open than adults to considering new things, new ideas. 
Some people have said that kids' writers concentrate on writing for the age range during which they themslves were least happy. I had a pretty happy childhood, all told, and a pretty miserable adolescence--and most of my books are for kids from 10-14, or older teens. 

Why do you think what you do matters? 

The letters--mostly e-mails now--that I get from kids tell me that ANNIE and other lesbian books of mine have helped them feel better about themselves, have given them hope and courage, and have made them realize they're "not the only one" and that they're okay--not sick,  evil, or doomed to having miserable lives. I've been told ANNIE made at least one girl decide not to kill herself. 
In the few letters I've gotten about ENDGAME, my novel about a school shooter who was badly bullied for years before he took a gun to school and used it, kids have told me their bullying stories, and at least one reader said that the book has made him more aware of the seriousness of bullying. Some  kids who've written me about ENDGAME have told me they "never" read, but that they really enjoyed the book. That pleases me greatly and makes me hope they'll go on to discover other books. 
One of my main goals as a writer is to indicate to kids that it's okay for them to be here, to follow their dreams, and to discover who they truly are. I consider that a great responsibility and a mission that does matter. 

What are the differences between writing for children and writing for teenagers? 

Teens and children, depending on the ages of the children, care about different things, worry about different things, and are interested in different things. I think the main difference in writing for young age groups lies in subject matter. 
HARRY POTTER may be changing this, but most books for children obviously tend to be shorter than books for teens.  Although I don't worry much about "big words" except for trying to make them clear in context, I'm more conscious of them when writing books for younger kids than in writing books for teens. 
I have written one picture storybook, MOLLY'S FAMILY, and that was an entirely different experience, and one that I found both exciting and challenging! Writing for very young children seems to me more like writing poetry than prose; every word counts and has to be perfect, and the overall length has to be strictly controlled.  Sometimes text has to be altered to fit better with illustrations. too. 

What did you read as a child/teenager? 

I read a lot as a child and a teen, and I was read to as well--even when I was old enough to read on my own. 
As a child one of my favorite books was RABBIT HILL by Robert Lawson. I also loved Milne's Pooh books, Kipling's Jungle books and JUST SO STORIES, Hugh Lofting's Dr. Doolittle books, Albert Payson Terhune's dog books and Walter Farley's horse books, Louisa May Alcott's books, and countless others. I loved books about kids and people who were different from me.  I also read a few books about war--I was a young child during World War II. 
As a teen I read a great many plays in addition to books, for I was  interested in and involved with theater. I read plays by Shakespeare, Tennessee Williams, Eugene O'Neil, Clifford Odets, Arthur Miller, and the works of many other playwrights.  I also read older books about war, a few kids' books about West Point, and many adult novels. Young adult literature hadn't really taken off yet when I was a teen; the few books written for teens tended to be series books like the Hardy Boys and Nancy Drew mysteries, and career-based books (like SUE BARTON, STUDENT NURSE) and romances for girls. Not much of that interested me. 
The book that had the most lasting effect on me as a teen was Radclyffe Hall's THE WELL OF LONELINESS, one of the first serious lesbian novels (for adults; there were none for teens in the 50s when I searched for them). It was published in England in the 1920s, and tried for obscenity (it is not obscene) both in England, where it was then banned, and in the US, where it was acquitted, if one can say that of a book. It's overwritten, melodramatic, and it ends sadly, but it painted a pretty honest picture of what it was like to be gay back in those days, and it ends with a heartfelt plea for justice and understanding that made me vow to someday write a book for my people that would end happily. ANNIE was that book, after many years, several false starts, and nine other published books. 

Can you tell us about the challenges of getting your first book published? 

Sure. I started out mostly trying to get published in magazines, and finally did get one poem published, and also sold one story. (As I remember, though, the magazine never did publish it!)  I wrote a book for young kids with my best friend; I wrote it and she illustrated it.  We made just about every mistake a young author and a young illustrator can make, so of course it didn't get anywhere, but we both remember it with great fondess.  I wrote a long gay novel that I never tried to have published--thank goodness, for it was full of problems, too--but it taught me a lot about how not to write a book. 
I made many attempts at getting a book published, and I remember having some long conversations with a kind and friendly editor about one of my attempts--but that didn't result in a sale.  Eventually, with my father's help, I got an agent, who tried to sell my work without success for what seemed to me to be a very long time. I finally wrote her a letter saying essentially "Is anyone out there?" because it seemed to me that no one was paying any attention to what I was writing--and not long after that she finally did sell my first two books: WHAT HAPPENED IN MARSTON, which I've mentioned above, and BERLIN: CITY SPLIT IN TWO, which is a non-fiction book about the German city of Berlin and the building and early years of the Berlin Wall. 
When I got my first author's copies, I thought I was really on my way and that I'd never again have trouble selling a manuscript!  Of course that was naive; almost all of us have trouble now and then. 

Do you have any advice for aspiring writers? 

Read, read, read! Read everything, but especially read the kinds of things you'd like to write.  And write, write, write!  Write everything, but especially write and experiment with the kinds of things you most care about writing.  Don't feel you have to have exotic experiences in order to find subject matter; draw on the experiences you have had, your reactions to them, and to life in general.  Write especially about the things you're passionate about. 
Read writers' magazines, read books about writing, take writing courses, join or form a critique group and share your work with others who are trying to write also. (Sometimes writers' groups aren't very helpful, but when they are, and when the members of a group care about and support one another, they can be invaluable.) 
And keep at it!  It's always been hard for new writers to break into the publishing world, but unfortunately today it seems to be harder than ever. (It's often even hard for those of us with many published books behind us.)  Publishing in general has become increasingly commercial, and many publishers are more concerned with the "bottom line" than used to be the case. Consequently, they're less willing to take a chance on new writers and to nurture fledgling ones.  Publishing is going through great changes right now, too, what with e-books and electronic publishing in general.  There are good things about those changes, but they're happening so fast that suddenly there's a brand new world for publishers  as well as writers to find places in.  The more you can learn about the new developments and find ways to adapt to them, the better--for in a sense, there are more opportunties for being published now than ever before, from traditional print book publishing to e-books, enhanced e-books, apps, and various forms of self-publishing. 
Again--if you're a new or aspiring writer, keep on reading and writing and learning--and don't give up!